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Does a Rogue with Cardsharp (Deadly Dealer) need the Quick Draw feat to keep throwing cards if he is holding the deck of cards if he has more attacks per round?

V2Blast
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Jhyarelle Silver
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1 Answers1

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RAW, they need Quick Draw

Deadly Dealer (via Card Sharp) treats the cards as darts. Darts are thrown weapons and therefore take an action to draw. This is in contrast to the shuriken which is thrown ammunition*.

*Of some note, the cards are destroyed on use just like thrown ammunition, unlike non-ammunition thrown weapons (such as darts).

Speak with your GM about the deck being "considered" the dart weapon, so as long as you "wield" the deck, you would be able to perform attacks with it. The damage is essentially the same as thrown ammunition options (see halfling sharpstones and throwing arrow) making this a very reasonable ruling.

Ifusaso
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  • I think it's a bit different than that though. If I had several darts in my off hand and didn't have to actually draw them from their storage quiver, would I not be able to throw multiple in a turn? Since it is assumed that the extra time to draw them is due to them being in a quiver or other type of storage, rather than being in hand already. I think the same situation would apply when holding a deck for Deadly Dealer. Also, throw weapons aren't normally destroyed on use, the only thrown weapon that is is the shuriken, due to its ammunition classification. – RevanantBacon Dec 01 '20 at 14:06
  • I was trying to state that thrown ammunition is destroyed on use (as are the cards) to draw a connection that it may have been "intended" that they work as ammunition (as opposed to regular thrown weapons, including darts). I'll try to be more clear. – Ifusaso Dec 01 '20 at 14:14
  • There is no function as written for you to have a handful of darts (also remember that they are nearly-arrow-darts, not game-of-darts, so you may be able to hold fewer than you think) to be able to throw them without drawing in between. I highly recommend it as a houserule, but it is not supported in the text. – Ifusaso Dec 01 '20 at 14:15
  • Related joke – Ifusaso Dec 01 '20 at 14:24
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    @RevenantBacon Also, to my knowledge, too, Ifusaso is correct: Pathfinder doesn't address holding multiple objects in a hand so that they're ready to be thrown. Thus you may be interested in this D&D 3.5 answer, specifically the section "Sage Advice: Holding multiple objects in one hand." – Hey I Can Chan Dec 01 '20 at 14:33
  • @Ifusaso I was only picturing holding 4 or 5 of them in an off-hand, not like a few dozen or anything like that. I expect that the designer used dats over shuriken simply because of proficiency issues. Wizards, being one of the primary targets for taking Arcane Strike, and by extension, Deadly Dealer, are only proficient with a handful of weapons, with darts being one of them. Meanwhile, almost no one is proficient with shuriken. I wonder if they meant to add that the cards should also have the ammunition property? – RevanantBacon Dec 01 '20 at 15:18
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    Couple things: related forum post on darts. From, deadly dealer ["a ranged weapon with 54 pieces of ammunition" Overall, you're not wrong though, it's just a poorly written feat that most gms would allow treating the cards as ammo for. – willuwontu Dec 01 '20 at 15:27
  • @RevenantBacon Don't get me wrong, I understand it. But I was just answer as written before providing that it should probably be ruled differently. – Ifusaso Dec 01 '20 at 21:18