0

This question is prompted by thinking about this question and the answer I gave there.

Consider the family of functions of the form \begin{equation} f_a(n):=\begin{cases} n/2 & \text{if $n$ is even}\\ an+1 & \text{if $n$ is odd}\\ \end{cases} \end{equation}

where $a$ is fixed and odd. The standard Collatz conjecture is about $f_3(n)$. Standard heuristics predict that for any odd $a>3$, $f_a(n)$ will have orbits will go to infinity, but this is open.

We can however, create a Collatz like situation where we allow multiple numbers and include new numbers in a new set. For example, consider the following: Let $S_0(n)=n$, and for $i>0$, define $S_i(n)$ as follows:

$S_i(n)= \{x \in {\mathbb{N}} | y \in S_{i-1}(n) \,\,\, \mathrm{where} \,\,\, \mathrm{and} \,\,\, x = 2y \,\,\, \mathrm{or} \,\,\, x=3y+1 \,\,\, \mathrm{or} \,\,\, 3y-1 \}$.

That is, if $x \in S_{i-1}(n)$ we put $x/2$ into $S_i(n)$, and if $x$ is odd then we put both $\frac{3x+1}{2}$ and $\frac{3x-1}{2}$ into $S_i(n)$. This is essentially then a variant of Collatz where at odd step we are allowed to "choose" either $\frac{3x+1}{2}$ or $\frac{3x-1}{2}$. It is easy to see that this if one is allowed this choice then for any $n$, there is some $i$ where $1 \in S_i(n)$ since for any odd $x$, one of $\frac{3x+1}{2}$ or $\frac{3x-1}{2}$ will always be even, and thus for any odd $x \in S_i$ we will have a number which is at most about $\frac{3}{4}x$ in $S_{i+1}(n)$.

However other similar examples seem less well behaved. Consider in particular the similar recursion $T_i(n)$ where $T_0(n)=n$, and where for $i >0$, $T_i(n)$ is defined as follows:

If $x \in T_{i-1}(n)$ we put $x/2$ into $T_i(n)$, and if $x$ is odd then we put both $\frac{3x+1}{2}$ and $\frac{5x+1}{2}$ into $T_i(n)$. It is not hard to show that $T_i(n)$ contains arbitrarily large elements, since for any odd $x$, one of $\frac{3x+1}{2}$ and $\frac{5x+1}{2}$ will be odd.

However, one suspects that the following is also true:

Conjecture 1: For any $n$, there is an $i$ where $1 \in T_i(n)$.

Conjecture is strictly weaker than the Collatz conjecture since we have more options to reach $1$).

The naive approach to A is to use the same sort of argument as we did for $S_i$ but this doesn't by itself work because although of our two numbers $\frac{3x+1}{2}$ and $\frac{5x+1}{2}$ one will still be even, but $\frac{5x+1}{4}$ is in general greater than $x$ so we don't get a reduction in size there.

We can weaken our conjecture even further:

Fix a positive odd integer $a \geq 3$, and define $T_{i,a}$ to be the same as $T_i$ except we now throw into $T_{i,a}(n)$ all of $3x+1$, $5x+1$, $\cdots ax+1$.

Question: Can we show that there is some odd $a$ such that for any $n$ for sufficiently large $i$, $1 \in T_{i,a}(n)$?

Two notes: First, this is different than the relaxation proposed by Max Alekseyev in this question where the new choice occurs when $x$ is even.

Second, it is not hard to at least show that for any $k$, there is an $a$ such that if $n \not \equiv -1 \pmod {2^k}$, then $T_{i,a}(n)$ will always contain at least one element smaller than $n$.

JoshuaZ
  • 6,090
  • I think that it is so easy to generate variants of Collatz that the onus is probably on the questioner to explain, not just the specific variant, but also why the answer to this variant is likely to be anything other than the usual "we don't know, and probably won't know without new techniques." – LSpice Jan 19 '24 at 20:10
  • @LSpice That's a fair point if one is making a variant where it is likely to be at the same difficulty. In this case, the version is what appears to be what at a glance should be much easier. If we cannot even solve this sort of question, that's a bit striking by itself. It is also worth considering in the following context: to some extent, Collatz is itself closely connected to how the 2-adics and 3-adics interact with each other, which is hard. So this can be thought of as asking a bit of, can we at least say something about how the 2-adics interact with general p-adics? – JoshuaZ Jan 19 '24 at 20:32
  • 2
    Hmm, don't know whether this is too trivial, but just for completeness. If you do not allow a (random) choice between $3n+1$ and $3n-1$ but relate it to the residue of $n$ modulo $4$ then this is an option to have a problem either with provable convergence or provable divergence for all $n$. Applied to $5n \pm 1$ it looks similar, but the convergence is perhaps not provable, don't know at the moment... – Gottfried Helms Jan 20 '24 at 07:27

0 Answers0