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言われるままを払った

"I paid as I was told to" Wouldn't it be 言われるままで払った? Are both correct? I mean theres not something called to way I was told that you can pay with right?

Soya
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1 Answers1

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When まま means "as-is" or "without modification", まま can work as a noun, a no-adjective and an adverb. You cannot say ままで:

"to pay as told"

  • 言われるままを払う: OK
  • 言われるままに払う: OK
  • 言われるまま払う: OK
  • *言われるままで払う: wrong

"to speak as one feels" / "to describe one's feelings as-is"

  • 感じたままを話す: OK
  • 感じたままに話す: OK
  • 感じたまま話す: OK
  • *感じたままで話す: wrong

(～た)ままで can be used when a certain state persists for a while:

  • 座ったままで動かない
  • 座ったまま動かない
  • 様子を見に行ったままで連絡がない
  • 様子を見に行ったまま連絡がない
naruto
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  • I understood everything but the を particle, why can it be attached to both of the two examples you just said? – Soya Jun 04 '19 at 16:22
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    @Irene Because まま is basically a noun, as any dictionary monolingual says. But it's hard to directly translate to English..."the same state", "something unchanged"? For example you can say トマトは生のままが美味しい, 生まれたままの姿, 言われたままの金額を払う, etc. – naruto Jun 04 '19 at 16:30
  • So for example ビールを買ったままで飲まなかった (The beers I bought still bought/still there, I haven't drank them) is it correct? – Soya Jun 05 '19 at 21:43
  • @Irene Yes that's perfectly correct, and 買ったままに飲まなかった is incorrect. – naruto Jun 06 '19 at 01:32
  • @naruto "Pay as I was told" can have two meanings. Here you seem to have interpreted it as "pay the amount of money I was told to pay". But, the more common interpretation would be "I payed because you told me to", e.g. Wife: "have you payed electric bill yet?", Husband: "Yes dear. I payed it yesterday just as you told me to". With this interpretation does using で become appropriate? – user3856370 Jun 07 '19 at 08:40
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    @user3856370 In that case you cannot use まま. You have to say 言われたとおり払ったよ or something like that. – naruto Jun 07 '19 at 08:46
  • @naruto so how would you say "I paid the way I was told" to meaning I paid the way my parents taught me? – Soya Jun 07 '19 at 17:15
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    @Irene I think naruto's suggestion of 言われたとおり払った would work for that too. This とおり means 'in accordance with' / 'in the same way as' / 'as' etc. – user3856370 Jun 08 '19 at 08:42
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    @Irene 言われたままを払った only refers to the amount of money, but 言われた通り払った is a rather flexible expression and it can refer to the paying method and/or the amount of money depending on the context. – naruto Jun 08 '19 at 09:04