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The other day, I came across a poster from the 1700s warning people of Italy of the plague. I've copied down the first paragraph of the message, taking the liberty of replacing long-s's with normal s's:

Accertati gl’illustrissimi Signori Conservatori di Sanità della strage cagionata dal mal del Vajolo ne Greggi esisteni a pascolo sopra le Montagne di Calf, Tremonzio, e Valceruteno dette il Monte Vione distretto di Valle Camonica hanno determinato di devenire a soliti opportuni provvedimenti diretti non meno alla pubblica, che alla privata discesa de Greggi di questo Dominio Serenissimo da tanto tempo, la Dio Merce, illesi, e sani.

I do not speak very good Italian, so I've very roughly translated the above using an Italian-English dictionary:

Make certain the illustrious Conservatoires of Health of the massacre caused by the variolate ache and Greggi existed in pasture over the Mountains of Calf, Tremonzio, and Valceruteno said the Monte Vione district of Valle Camonica have determined to deviate to usual appropriate measures directed no less to the public, than to the private descent of Greggi of this very Serene Domain for so long, the God Merce, unharmed, and healthy.

This translation certainly seems to give a common theme, but upon closer inspection is somewhat nonsense. I think I have the general themes of the sentences down, but the grammar and structure wrong. What am I missing here? Is it a product of the archaic speech, or a bad translation?

Nico A
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    Welcome to Italian.SE! – Charo May 14 '18 at 19:36
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    High quality content in this post. This page is a perfect example of how translation questions on this site should look in my view. It is about a sentence which is not trivial to translate with a vocabulary or Google Translate; the asker gave some context and a first attempt at translation and elaborated on where his/her problem is. The answer by @DenisNardin provides both a literal translation and one which flows better, and discusses all the difficult key points with care and detail. I just wanted to congratulate both of you. – Federico Poloni May 14 '18 at 21:14

1 Answers1

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The sentence is in a very formal Italian, with many implicit subordinates that is not easy to translate in English (a language rather uncomfortable with complex syntax). In particular some adjectives that are quite far from the noun they are referring to are related back to it thanks to the concordance in gender and number (e.g. the illesi e sani) and the same holds for subject and verb (Conservatori and hanno determinato).

The word order also is different from the standard English one. Moreover, you missed the meaning of a couple of words (Greggi, herds and Mercé, mercy). The archaic orthography of some other words of course doesn't help.

The main problem here is that it is not enough to know the meaning of the words, you need to be steeped in the syntax of the language, which is the art of putting those words in relation with each other, else the sentence becomes, as the Romans said, arena sine calce, sand without lime, which cannot be used to build walls.

The following is my best shot at a literal translation

The Most Illustrious Lords Protectors of Health[1], after having been informed of the carnage caused by the smallpox in the Herds puts to pasture on the Mountains of Calf, Tremonzio and Valceruteno called Monte Vione, in the district of Val Camonica, determined to resort to the usual appropriate measures with the aim of the public as well as private descent of the Herds of this for a long time, thanks to God's mercy, Most Serene Domain unharmed and healthy.

Note the big (and frankly ungrammatical in English) aside starting with after having been informed and ending with Val Camonica. Also, I'm not quite sure how to convey it in English but the final words unharmed and healthy are referred to the Herds, not to the Domain. If I had to make it in more understandable English I would turn the sentences a bit to make

After having been informed of the carnage caused by the smallpox in the Herds puts to pasture on the Mountains of Calf, Tremonzio and Valceruteno called Monte Vione, in the district of Val Camonica, the Most Illustrious Lords Protectors of Health determined to resort to the usual appropriate measures with the aim of making all the Herds come downhill, unharmed and healthy, both public and private, of this heretofore Most Serene Domain, thanks to God's mercy.

It's still not great, but I don't think I can make it more legible without chopping off some formalities (e.g. the thanks to God's mercy).

[1] Lord Protectors of Health is a literal and a bit silly translation of Signori Conservatori della Sanità, but it is probably just some title for the public officials in charge of health matters

Marco
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Denis Nardin
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    Thank you so much! The next section opens with the word “Esseqvendo”, which I cannot find anywhere. Do you have any idea what it means? – Nico A May 14 '18 at 19:14
  • I'd need more context. It's certainly an archaism, and note that the v is an archaic symbol for u (until surprisingly recently v and u were the same letter). It could be Eseguendo. – Denis Nardin May 14 '18 at 19:29
  • That’s helpful. The context is “Esseqvendo illustrissimi Signori Vincenzo Dandalo Podestà...” – Nico A May 14 '18 at 19:33
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    I'm afraid that's not enough. That's the problem with these very formal sentences, sometimes the key word to understand it is buried after three lines of stuff. – Denis Nardin May 14 '18 at 19:34
  • Whew, the whole statement (one sentence!) is, “Essequendo l’illustrissimi Signori Vincenzo Dandalo Podestà & Antonio Grimani Capitanio Rettori dignissimi di Brescia & suo distretto, & li Magnifici Signori Deputati alla Sanità le lettere dell illustrissimi Signori Proueditori alla Sanità di Venetia del 17. Corrente, & volendo con ogni humanita proueder alla publica salute, & Conseruatione di questa Città & suo distretto, acciocché mediante l’aiuto Diuno l’horribil male della peste da essa stia lontano, qual per quanto s’intende ogn’hor piu si va dalatando in diuresi paesi” – Nico A May 14 '18 at 19:52
  • I actually think I might understand that it means “Executing”, but what really throws me off there is Diuno, humanita proueder, diuresi and dalatando. No idea what any of those are. – Nico A May 14 '18 at 19:53
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    @TheFox You're mixing up us and vs. The words are, respectively, Divino (Divine), umanità (humanity), diversi (numerous), and dilatando (spread) [translations only in this context, in different contexts other translations are appropriate]. Are you sure you're reading the typeface correctly? These old character sets can be very weird from time to time. – Denis Nardin May 14 '18 at 19:58
  • You’re right. This old typeface is screwing me up, and it doesn’t help that that entire paragraph is written so smaller that it fits on two lines of paper that is a little smaller than standard size. Thank you! – Nico A May 14 '18 at 20:01
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    “Dominio Serenissimo” refers to the Republic of Venice, which ruled over Valcamonica for some centuries. – egreg May 14 '18 at 20:30
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    "Essequire" is indeed an (archaic?) variant of "eseguire", "to execute" – Tobia Tesan May 14 '18 at 23:44
  • I am reasonably convinced that sentence reads like "[The Lords Vincenzo Dandalo and ... Grimani Capitanio and ... and the noble public health officials], in accordance with the instructions (literally: letters) issued on the 17th day of this month by the most illustrious Superintendents of Health, and in [...] the interest of public health and [...] safety of this City and its districts, and so that with God's help the Plague - which is currently spreading throughout many countries - may stay away..." Please post a new question or edit your previous one for a more detailed analysis :) – Tobia Tesan May 14 '18 at 23:58
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    I know near-zero Italian, but I disagree with your comments on English grammar. The long pre-amble is certainly awkward in English, but it’s not ungrammatical—and it’s perfectly readable, barring some minor quibbles with syntax (“puts”→“put” to match in number with “Herds”). It’s after that point that things get really hairy. And your use of a semicolon in the revised version isn’t actually accurate (the first half, while long, isn’t a complete sentence), while “descend unharmed and healthy” is both an odd choice of verb, and not what I would read from the original version’s “descent.” – KRyan May 15 '18 at 01:06
  • If you want to avoid such a long pre-amble (and English does want to do that), you should probably actually separate the two sentences, perhaps “The Lords Protectors of Health have been informed [...]. Therefore, [...]” or similar. The “thanks to God’s mercy” bit might be clearer as a parenthetical. And the verb should probably be “keep” unharmed and healthy, or similar. If “descent” should appear at all, it probably belongs with “public and private,” that is, “of public and private descent.” – KRyan May 15 '18 at 01:14
  • @KRyan Yes, I should have maybe said unidi I Matic rather than ungrammatical. That said English syntax is really ackward with such complex sentences, while the syntax of more inflected languages can cope more easily. Regarding discesa I think you are misunderstanding the meaning: here is referring to the act of going downhill, that's why I paraphrased provide for the descent as make descend, but I retrospect I sho I ld have written make come down or somesuch. I'll abridge my translation. And you're right that the semicolon is not correct. – Denis Nardin May 15 '18 at 05:27
  • What symbol would you suggest to denote the closure of a long aside? Thank you for the comments – Denis Nardin May 15 '18 at 05:27
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    A small note for those trying to improve my translation: while I am grateful for the suggestions, I'd prefer that you worked on the second version and left the literal translation alone. Yeah, it's not good English but it's not meant to be. – Denis Nardin May 15 '18 at 08:54
  • Like I said, English really just wants these to be two separate sentences. If you want them as a single sentence, with the preamble as a subordinate clause introduced by After, the best you get is a comma, so far as I can tell. – KRyan May 15 '18 at 13:12