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This is a big issue between my husband and me. He says always put a comma after a name, I say only when a break is needed. Example:

A review of the complaint filed by Andrew, shows that Linnea, and John, did in fact violate state laws when they were covering up the crimes of officer Johns, and that Andrew, in fact, has a rightful claim against the Defendants.

F1Krazy
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A. McGowan
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    It sounds like your husband is trying to apply the rule for direct address (i.e. set off the addressee's name with a comma) to all uses of a person's name, which is not correct. – Kevin Aug 28 '22 at 19:01
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    A name for the rule Kevin refers to is "vocative comma". Searching with that term will find more advice about the rule. – Ergwun Aug 29 '22 at 05:34
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    Don't you have any books at home? You'll only have to read a couple pages to figure out that this "rule" doesn't exist. – IMil Aug 29 '22 at 13:23
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    @IMil possibly all their books are from several hundred years ago when commas were used more liberally, and to my eyes randomly. I've always pictured people back then with corsets and waistcoats so tight they need to catch their breath every three or four words. – CCTO Aug 29 '22 at 14:03
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    It's inconsistent that in fact is not set off with commas in "did in fact violate" but is set off with commas in "Andrew, in fact, has". – Wyck Aug 29 '22 at 14:10
  • @Wyck I find both usages consistent with how I would write them. – Greg Martin Aug 30 '22 at 01:53
  • Related: in many languages the vocative case (which is not the case here) must to be isolated by commas, obligatorily: "I already told you, John, this violates state laws.". Maybe that's where your husband's confusion came from (but I don't know if that rule applies to English). – Gerardo Furtado Aug 30 '22 at 04:13
  • The suggested comma only makes sense if there is another comma before 'suggested'. The suggested rule does not exist. The onus of proof is on the suggester. – user207421 Aug 30 '22 at 10:25
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    @GerardoFurtado It does apply to English, though native English speakers often skip them—though probably wouldn’t in a sentence like yours, with “you, John” pretty much demanding a comma (though of course if you get informal enough, there are no commas, or even no punctuation). But it wouldn’t be surprising to see a native speaker write “Hey John that violates state laws,” even though it should be “Hey, John, that violates state laws.” (And it may very well be overcorrection of this tendency to forget commas in the vocative case that is causing the husband’s overuse of commas around names.) – KRyan Aug 30 '22 at 14:18
  • Hubby may be thinking of nonessential appositives, where (roughly) you DO put commas around a name which isn't strictly required for the sentence to work because it's referring to the same person again. e.g. "My husband, Mr. McGowan, isn't completely crazy." – A C Aug 31 '22 at 07:56

2 Answers2

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It's easy to find examples where a comma would be totally wrong: "Michael said John was drunk" means something completely different from "Michael, said John, was drunk".

Michael Kay
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    Or the classic example, which became the title of a book about just this sort of thing: Describing a panda: "eats shoots and leaves" which becomes "eats, shoots, and leaves". (Cover image showing a panda holding a gun and walking out of frame...) – Darrel Hoffman Aug 29 '22 at 17:38
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    Taking the husband’s suggested rule literally, we’d have “Michael, said, John, was drunk,” which reads to me like you’re watching a damaged, stuttering video tape, and the commas barely mean anything at all. Definitely isn’t correct. – KRyan Aug 30 '22 at 14:20
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Proper nouns are, for punctuation purposes, exactly like common nouns. Since, therefore, you would write:

A review of the complaint filed by the shopkeeper shows that the secretary and the clerk did in fact violate state laws when they were covering up the crimes of the officer, and that the shopkeeper, in fact, has a rightful claim against the Defendants.

you would write the same lack of commas with names.

Note that "officer Johns/the officer" has a comma after it because it ends an independent clause, and the second "Andrew/the shopkeeper" does because it is followed by a parenthetical phrase.

Mary
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