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Here, John Lawler writes the following:

Commas are not determined by grammar or by which words they follow. Comma indicates a particular intonation. If you would use that intonation in speaking the sentence, use a comma; if not, don't. So it's important to hear what you're writing, in your mind if nowhere else.

Sticking to this advice, how would you punctuate the following sentence without setting a comma before "then"?

If f, g, and h are functions then f(gh) = (fg)h.

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ueuue
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  • How would you say it out loud, and where would your voice dip? Mine would dip after f, g, and functions. YMMV. And there's a full-stop intonation at the end. (Incidentally, the correct way to pronounce f(gh) = (fg)h is "F of GH equals FG of H"). – John Lawler Jul 10 '16 at 17:45
  • @JohnLawler: My voice wouldn't dip at all. So, sticking to your advice, I would write: "If f g and h are functions then f(gh) = (fg)h." But this doesn't look nice since f isn't separated by g then. – ueuue Jul 10 '16 at 17:53
  • I would use no comma at all. I would introduce a comma before then in a sentence that is more complicated and can easily be misunderstood or not well understood without the comma. That is especially the case for sentences that include multiple phrases that are themselves set off using commas. – Drew Jul 10 '16 at 17:55
  • @ueuue: So, you're a native speaker, that's the way it is. You might consider the possibility that you're not hearing an intonation dip, if you're not phonetically trained to recognize them. It can be difficult to recognize phenomena in one's own speech. – John Lawler Jul 10 '16 at 17:57
  • @JohnLawler: In fact, I am not a native speaker. Instead, I am trying to learn English. My native tongue is German. Since the German comma usage is very stupid, I like the idea that a comma should indicate an intonation dip, which would improve readability. But most German authors don't stick to this idea. – ueuue Jul 10 '16 at 18:02
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    German punctuation is governed by grammar. Different system entirely. This is for English. Listen to native speakers pronounce standard texts and learn to recognize the dip; it's not that different from German, at least in long constituents. Shorter ones usually don't bother. So it makes sense for visual recognition (and by convention in math) individual letters in a list are separated by commas just to indicate the list boundaries. If there were a long list in speech, the dips would be there. – John Lawler Jul 10 '16 at 18:15
  • @JohnLawler: Do you think that the German punctuation system governed by grammar is worse than the English punctuation system governed by intonation? – ueuue Jul 10 '16 at 18:21
  • I don't make value judgements about other languages or their orthographic machinery. It probably suits some people and not others, like most technology. – John Lawler Jul 10 '16 at 18:26
  • @JohnLawler: Do you think that one could use a punctuation system governed by intonation for German? – ueuue Jul 10 '16 at 18:55
  • I have no idea. Speak to a German linguist, or better yet an editor. – John Lawler Jul 10 '16 at 19:28
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    English punctuation is governed by style guides. The rules vary between publications, leave room for exceptions and authors' discretion, and some are simply arbitrary and traditional. Generally speaking, the rules are promulgated to lead readers to make the correct parse of linear text. And while there's no doubt that natural pauses in reading from text often coincide with commas in the written text, where you would pause in speaking is a poor guide for comma placement. – deadrat Jul 10 '16 at 19:38
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    Those aren't the real rules, though; those are just the pretend rules that teachers can handle. The real rules don't exist; just individual sets of habits that get along. Like a 30-year old car that still runs. – John Lawler Jul 10 '16 at 22:03

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