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Suppose there are three options: "A", "B", and "C", and two people each have to choose one of them. I want to say a sentence like the following:

"They both chose the same option".

As far as I know, "the" is the correct article. But it really bothers me. I am not specifying which option they chose (e.g. "B"), and it could be any of them ("A", "B", or "C"). So I would really like to use the phrase "a same option" to emphasize that we don't know which was chosen. What's the reasoning behind the "the" in this case?

apaderno
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Honza
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  • The logic is that there is only one option which is the one that they chose, so we use the definite article 'the'. This still applies whether we know or not which option was chosen. – Michael Harvey Nov 24 '23 at 15:56
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    But it doesn't make any logical sense. I can say that "I chose an option". It is also only one of them. I want an equivalent expression when two people do it (and THE choice itself is the same).

    I get that "the choice" should use "the". But in front of the option should logically be "a", when I am talking about it for the first time and want to emphasize it.

     – Honza Nov 24 '23 at 16:10
  • English does not have to make any 'logical sense'. – Michael Harvey Nov 24 '23 at 16:12
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    I was hoping that this would have a satisfactory logical explanation that I just don't see. But thanks – Honza Nov 24 '23 at 16:14
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    Sure, you can say I chose an* option. but I chose an that John chose* implies that one or both of you chose multiple options, but there was only one option chosen by both of you. Whereas I chose the* [same] option that John chose* strongly implies we each made only one choice (and it was *the same* choice). – FumbleFingers Nov 24 '23 at 17:24
  • I want to express precisely "They chose AN identical option" (i.e. it is important that it could be any of them). As written in an answer below. My remaining question is if "They chose the same option." can be understood in exactly the same way. If not, then "same" has a different meaning than I thought, otherwise, "the same" is ambiguous as an adjective and English is weird. – Honza Nov 24 '23 at 18:34
  • The main purpose of "the" is to mark an NP as definite, which is what it is doing in your example. – BillJ Nov 24 '23 at 19:54
  • But my main point is that "same option" in the meaning of "identical option" is not definite in a sense that it could be any of the options, but they just chose an identical one. So is the usage of "the same" correct, or do I have to use a different word??? – Honza Nov 24 '23 at 20:50
  • @Honza why don't you approve the suggested edit? – Nike Dattani Nov 25 '23 at 01:56
  • I didn't know that was a thing....

    But I don't like the phrase "instead of" in the title. I know that mostly "the same" makes better logical sense but my point is that in niche cases like mine "a" would be logically better. The phrase "instead of" would suggest I want to do it all the time.

    I approved it but modified the title.

     – Honza Nov 25 '23 at 09:11
  • It has probably the most complete answer. Thanks. The answer for my previous question is thus that it is the same as an identical. And so it is ambiguous and from my point of view not very logical. – Honza Nov 25 '23 at 21:44

1 Answers1

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First of all you are correct that the proper sentence is:

"They both chose the same option",

rather than:

"They both chose a same option".

If you want to use the "a" article, you could say:

"They both chose an identical option".

So an interesting question would be, why is it that we use the phrase "the same option" but we use the phrase "an identical option"? The following search in Google:

"the same" vs "a same"

gives the following results (among many, many more):

From ELL Stack Exchange

From ELU Stack Exchange

From elsewhere

Nike Dattani
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  • So it really boils down to the fact that "same" is simply never used with the indefinite article? Even when logically and grammatically "a same" in some cases should make sense..... (disregarding the rule "same means the same")

    Anyways, thanks for a satisfactory alternative that says exactly the same and uses "an".

     – Honza Nov 24 '23 at 16:28
  • Before answering your follow-up question about what it "boils down to", have you read all the explanations in all those links? – Nike Dattani Nov 24 '23 at 16:33
  • Some of them, but the usual explanation is simply that "same" is definite. Which in my case is simply not logically true when "an identical option" says the same to the letter. – Honza Nov 24 '23 at 16:38
  • @Honza I think you're focusing on the meaning and ignoring the grammatical distinction. When they say it's "definite", they're talking about the grammar. The word "identical" is not "definite" in the same way "same" is. I'd like to note that this isn't unique to English, either, some other languages have a similar situation with their word for "same". – Dan Getz Nov 24 '23 at 17:45
  • Hmm, so either "same" and "identical" are not synonyms (when used as adjectives). Or there exists a grammatical rule that says that same is definite. Either is weird from my point of view.

    Maybe to better understand it, does "They both chose the same option" mean exactly the same as "They both chose an identical option"??? If it is the same then "the same" is ambiguous and the "the" got there from an illogical grammatical rule. Otherwise same and identical are not precise synonyms and "same" CANNOT be used to express my desired meaning.

     – Honza Nov 24 '23 at 18:20
  • @Honza Most synonyms are not identical, and the same meaning can be expressed in multiple non-identical ways. – Dan Getz Nov 25 '23 at 00:16
  • I know that. But that's not the answer to my question in the previous comment...... Are you saying that I cannot use the word same to express my precise meaning? – Honza Nov 25 '23 at 09:17