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It occurs to me all the time, when I encounter a new word like a name/surname (say, SUE VERTUE) I ask myself, how do English native speakers know what to pronounce this new word even if they've never heard of it before? Accordingly, I thought there must be a sort of knowledge to help gaining such an ability.

Therefore, here the question arises is: How we as ESL/EFL people could learn about it and what materials/knowledge could be helpful throughout obtaining it?

Devin Hudson
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  • Have you asked yourself this question? "How do I know how to pronounce an unfamiliar word in my own language?" There are many resources available to help ESL students master English phonetics. Have you tried a Google search? (Note that surnames are a often problem for everyone, regardless of language...) – P. E. Dant Reinstate Monica Jun 10 '17 at 01:55
  • @P.E.Dant thank you, although even in my own language out of 10, 9 or 8 guesses of a new surname or generally a new word turns out right almost for everyone. and for the search, I have to say, honestly I didn't know what to search and this is not the phonetics solo, it's coming along with some kind of experience people gain through lifetime. – Devin Hudson Jun 10 '17 at 02:03
  • So you see? It is the same for English speakers as for speakers of your own language—"experience". You may not want to study phonetics "solo", but learning the way English is customarily pronounced may give you a foundation upon which to base that experience. – P. E. Dant Reinstate Monica Jun 10 '17 at 02:12
  • You should not consider proper names English words. Even if you started speaking German, the name would not change. The reality is that if you have never heard it spoken you can only guess based on similar looking words (for example Vertue vs. virtue). – user3169 Jun 10 '17 at 04:47
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    If you mean words in general you should use an example that is not a name. – user3169 Jun 10 '17 at 04:49
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    You have made the classic mistake of thinking that all native speakers can pronounce all words. This simply isn't true. In fact, many intelligence tests (particularly those given to children) include sections where one is asked to read words off a list out loud, which tests their ability to get the correct pronunciation of an unfamiliar word. – Catija Jun 10 '17 at 12:47

2 Answers2

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It's likely the same in English as in any other language. You make your best guess from a set of rules:

  1. Does the word/name look similar to other words which you know how to pronounce? Here, for example, "Vertue" looks like "virtue" so I would choose to pronounce it similarly, with a slight emphasis on "e" not "i".

  2. Sound the name out phonetically using common English pronunciation rules. For example, the American politician "John Boehner", whose last name I would (incorrectly) pronounce "BOW-ner" (it's actually "BAY-ner"). Which leads us to:

  3. Does this look like a "borrowed" word from a foreign language? If that is so, pronounce using the rules of that language. Example, "L'Ardoise" is pronounced as it would be in French, "l'ardwah". Meanwhile "Boehner" derives from one of the Germanic languages, and so you could go with the standard "oeh" pronunciation from that ("BEH-ner") -- which is still wrong, so:

  4. Listen to the person pronounce it themselves and copy that. For example the actress Demi Moore is frequently called "DEH-mi", but she actually pronounces her name with the accent on the second syllable, "duh-MI". And finally.

  5. If it's a proper name in Wales, give up.

Andrew
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  • I'm not sure the name Boehner is a good example, since this is not an English name. My guess is that it's German, it which case it would actually originally be pronounced like 'boo-ner'. – paddotk Jun 10 '17 at 18:00
  • And then there are American names like Przeszczybynski. :) – BobRodes Jun 10 '17 at 19:13
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    @BobRodes ... "American"... but certainly not "Engilsh". With that many zs and ys it can only be Polish :P – Catija Jun 10 '17 at 19:33
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    @poepje Boehner is a perfect example. It may have been pronounced a particular way in "the old country" but that doesn't mean that ( now foreign language pronunciation) is going to be the way it's pronounced here in the US, especially if that name has existed here for several generations, which according to me, makes it an American name that doesn't have to follow the rules of the pronunciation of whatever language it may have come from. – green_ideas Jun 10 '17 at 19:59
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    @Clare In addition, you have to consider that generations ago, many immigrants coming to America weren't literate. They knew how to pronounce their names, but not necessarily how to spell them "properly" so when the clerks wrote them down they may have been misspelled. – ColleenV Jun 10 '17 at 20:13
  • @Catija Yes, I made it up, and it is a slight exaggeration of some names I've seen growing up in an American city with a large Polish community. My favorite real one was a kid in school named Jim Przybszcz. He called it "Shee-bish." The actual Polish pronunciation is PZHEE-bishch. – BobRodes Jun 10 '17 at 22:34
  • @Colleen yes and clerks often had to guess how to spell what an immigrant was saying, which leads us right back to this question. – green_ideas Jun 10 '17 at 23:08
  • @Clare True enough foreign names have grown into 'distorted' versions over the decades/centuries, but nevertheless Andrew states here how you should phonetically pronounce what the name is written like, and even mentions how he pronounces this particular example wrong (which is kind of contradicting in the first place). – paddotk Jun 12 '17 at 21:47
  • @poepje Illustrative, not contradictory. Most people mispronounce this name because they rely on common English rules, and it isn't until they're told it's incorrect that they have to move to the next model (listening to how the owner himself pronounces it). But I'll edit my answer to make this clear – Andrew Jun 13 '17 at 14:35
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The simple answer is that we don't! Not without asking, and it is very common to ask a person how their name is spelled when hearing it for the first time.

My last name, Rodes, I pronounce like the word roads. I've heard ROA-deez and ROA-duss quite a bit. The opposite side of this is if I tell people my name, I usually have to spell it out or they will spell it Rhodes, the more common spelling for the last name.

English is notoriously inconsistent in the way words with similar spellings are pronounced, and in the way words with similar pronunciations are spelled. Native speakers make mistakes in pronunciation (and spelling) all the time.

A well-known example is words ending in -ough, which have no fewer than five different pronunciations! Rough, dough, through, bough and cough are pronounced ruff, doe, throo, bow and koff. You'll also notice that dough and doe are homonyms, meaning that they sound alike while being spelled differently and having different meanings.

Conversely, the words was, does, fuzz and because all rhyme with one another: they are pronounced wuz, duz, fuz and bee-CUZ.

When I was younger, I heard the word "misled" (miss-LED) and understood it, but when I read it I thought of it as MY-zuld. It took me quite a long time to realize that they were the same word! So it isn't just ESL speakers who find this confusing. We all do, and much of our spelling has to be learned by rote.

As for proper nouns, we make mistakes even more often. The spelling of American cities and states, for example, can be extremely inconsistent with the way that they are pronounced, and mistakes are quite common.

Many city and state names are transliterations of Native American names for the areas or people who lived in them, some by the French and some by the English. States and cities that were originally French territories were often named whatever the Native Americans called them, written out using French pronunciation. These have often been altered over time by pronouncing the French words they were English.

For example, the city of Detroit is pronounced duh-TROYT or dee-TROYT. The Detroit River was originally thought to be a strait (a narrow passage of water connecting two large bodies of water, e.g. the Strait of Gibraltar). The French word for strait is détroit, pronounced (approximately) day-ter-WA. The English pronunciation took over entirely, probably because the French word is hard for English speakers to pronounce.

Another good example of this is Illinois. The original Native American name was pronounced ee-lee-nwah. Today, the French would spell this Ilinois, although spellings were much less consistent 300 years ago, and the spelling Illinois was common along with other spellings. English pronunciation of this word is ill-in-OYZ. But the final Z sound never got put on, so the present pronunciation of Illinois is ill-in-OY.

One more example is Michigan. The original Native American name was mee-shee-gah. The French Michigan is a close approximation of this. The American pronunciation is MI-shi-gun (the British say MI-tchi-gun). So you can see that the French influence on spelling plays havoc with the way that these words are currently pronounced.

If you google "pronunciations of cities in usa" you will see a number of posts with help on the matter.

BobRodes
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    And Houston - Hyu-ston vs How-ston... Both are correct but used in different places. – Catija Jun 10 '17 at 19:34
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    @Catija I had never heard of "Howston" so I looked it up. For others like me, there is a street in New York called Houston street, pronounced How-ston. As I understand it, New Yorkers still pronounce the city in Texas Hyoo-ston. Interesting. – BobRodes Jun 10 '17 at 22:09