3

I'm trying to identify the key of a tuba in the below picture. I suspect it's either a Bb or a Eb but cannot confirm. I tried to measure and it was approx. just over 16ft (although that may be inaccurate). The tuba and the case are of the same brand "Virtuosi". Virtuosi was a British company that's now dissolved which makes it difficult to find information about it.

It has 3 valves, on the valves it has the numbers "0705042" engraved. The diameter of the bell is 16".

I used the wayback machine to try and find more info about the company, but sadly there's a few pictures on the website so I cannot compare images.

The main website: https://web.archive.org/web/20060214044030/http://www.virtuosi.co.uk/

I think a reseller: you can see a EEb and BBb mentioned https://web.archive.org/web/20160808231142/http://www.firstbrass.co.uk/index.php?cPath=1_27_134&

https://web.archive.org/web/20160808230251/http://www.firstbrass.co.uk/index.php?cPath=1_27_133&

https://web.archive.org/web/20100203002313/http://www.jpbrass.co.uk/instrument_cat.php?cat=2

Virtuosi tuba

Update:

So I tried playing some notes with the Tuner & Metronome App open on Android without pressing any of the valves, without purposely trying to play the lowest note possible the app gave back Bb. B-flat

If I tried to play the lowest note possible it would say Ab.
A-flat

I assume this means it's an Bb?

Also, to enforce it's a Bb, I mistakenly previously thought that the additional tube in the case was for some optional tuning but realised it's to hold the mouth piece so it faces the other way. So that would add approx. another 1ft to my measurement which would bring it closer to the 18ft for a Bb.

Shoejep
  • 133
  • 5
  • 1
    Have you tried playing the tuba? What pitches does it produce when no valves are pressed? – phoog Mar 24 '23 at 07:59
  • @phoog I haven't played for over a decade, I'm also not very good at identifying notes or pitches :( – Shoejep Mar 24 '23 at 08:01
  • @Shoejep: there is software on the net exactly for that purpose. You play the note (with an instrument, or with your voice) and it tells you the note. In the case of voice, it can help you "adjust" your singing to reproduce clearer notes. For that, you only need a microphone connected to your computer. You might even find such software for the smartphone. – virolino Mar 24 '23 at 08:12
  • @Shoejep Even if you haven’t played for a decade you should be able to produce a note. Use a tuning device/application to determine the pitch if necessary. – Lazy Mar 24 '23 at 08:22
  • Thanks all, I'll make an attempt today – Shoejep Mar 24 '23 at 08:23
  • @Shoejep Welcome to Music.SE! Out of curiosity, why aren't C and F options? (I doubt it's a C, but it could be an F.) – Richard Mar 24 '23 at 12:36
  • 1
    @Richard Bb and Eb are just the main ones I've heard of. I've read somewhere that C is less popular in the UK. It's possible it could be any of them I guess. – Shoejep Mar 24 '23 at 18:31

2 Answers2

2

According to Wikipedia

The main tube of a B♭ tuba is approximately 18 feet (5.5 m) long, while that of a C tuba is 16 feet (4.9 m), of an E♭ tuba 13 feet (4.0 m), and of an F tuba 12 feet (3.7 m).

You can measure the length with reasonable accuracy by attaching a piece of string to the bell and running it around the tubing — straight across the valve section — to the mouthpiece.

As @Tim says, you can just blow the fundamental to determine the pitch. But another trick that works on trumpet is to gently (gently!) tap the mouthpiece with your palm. This will produce, quietly, the lowest open pitch on the instrument.

Aaron
  • 87,951
  • 13
  • 114
  • 294
  • Actually, tapping is what I used to do before playing a note on trumpet - it gave me the basic pitch, before my embouchure developed. – Tim Mar 24 '23 at 09:42
  • 3
    Re tapping the mouthpiece GENTLY: I don't know much about brass, but I know that "mouthpiece extractors" are a thing, and it's possible to get the mouthpiece jammed in so tight that they're needed. – Andy Bonner Mar 24 '23 at 14:38
  • Thanks for your advice, FWIW I tried the tapping method but it didn't last long enough to register on the app – Shoejep Mar 24 '23 at 18:33
  • @Shoejep Good point. I suppose one would have to sing the pitch produced by the tapping in order for an app to identify it. – Aaron Mar 24 '23 at 18:35
1

Play the lowest note possible, with no valves pressed. That will give you the fundamental of the instrument. Quite loose lips will help here. As you tighten, the next note up is the 5th, and above that, the octave of the original. Match those to a piano or other instrument, and you have it.

For instance, matching on a piano will give the exact note. Matching the fifth to an open B♭ trumpet base note will reveal it's a B♭ tuba, albeit the notes may be an octave or two apart. It's pretty well going to be B♭ or E♭, as you suspect.

Tim
  • 192,860
  • 17
  • 187
  • 471
  • 2
    The lowest note possible is a bit vague if we consider the possibilty of pedal tones. – Lazy Mar 24 '23 at 10:47
  • @Lazy - I don't understand. When you blow to produce a fundamental on a brass instrument, my experience is it's that fundamental. Pedal tones are used in music. – Tim Mar 24 '23 at 11:10
  • Pedal tones are lower than the fundamentals. – Lazy Mar 24 '23 at 11:31
  • 4
    Or perhaps the pedal tone is the fundamental, in which case the next note up is an octave above. And this latter pitch sounds like what Tim is referencing. – Richard Mar 24 '23 at 12:35
  • Tim, I wonder if your question about @Lazy's post is answered here: What are brass instrument "pedal tones" and "false tones", and how are they different?. (Or possibly: What are the acoustics of brass instrument pedal tones?.) – Aaron Mar 24 '23 at 14:32
  • @Aaron - good thinking: you're very good at finding these things! Thanks. – Tim Mar 24 '23 at 15:15
  • It's a very different instrument, but I cannot blow the lowest possible note on my French horn. I can't even blow notes close to it - it's as hard to extend down as it is up. Not sure about tuba but I could see different instruments being challenging to blow the "fundamental". – Todd Wilcox Mar 24 '23 at 15:30
  • Oh also, from my point of view, the "fundamental" of an instrument is an octave below the first harmonic, not a fifth below. The first harmonic of a series is twice the frequency of the fundamental. This highlights how the concept of playing the lowest note to find the "fundamental" can be easier said than done. If you blow into a brass instrument and can play a bit of the overtone series, then you can determine the key/fundamental, even if you can't play the actual fundamental. E.g., if you do blow a note, then the 5th, then the octave, you know the first note you blew is the key. – Todd Wilcox Mar 24 '23 at 15:42
  • @ToddWilcox - there's some confusion with naming harmonics, as some folk prefer to call the base note (fundamental) the 1st harmonic. I can't understand that. (New question coming up..?) – Tim Mar 24 '23 at 16:04
  • @Tim I played with relatively loose lips and the app said it was Bb but this wasn't the lowest note possible as I purposely tried to play low notes and the app said it was Ab. Is this a good indication it's a Bb? – Shoejep Mar 24 '23 at 20:10
  • I guess it's a Bb instrument with that result. Well done. – Tim Mar 24 '23 at 20:32
  • @Tim Okay, great :) Thanks for your advice – Shoejep Mar 24 '23 at 21:06
  • 2
    The lowest EASILY playable note is probably an octave above the fundamental 'pedal note'. It's quite possible to loosen the embouchure and bend this down a tone or so. If the first note wasn't particularly well 'centered', this might lead to confusion. – Laurence Mar 25 '23 at 00:10